[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next]
  • Thread Index
  • Date Index
  • Subject Index
  • LOOP / Caps / Haul direction



    Walter & Group...

    REMINDER:  We are still looking for the missing Winter 2003 issue of the LOOP.

    If you find it in your records or collections, please notify Editor Denise Maxwell at : goldnwst@xxxxxxxxx

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

                                                                                CAPS

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    From Lefty Kreh :

    Gordy--many years ago at my casting seminars I would  had people cast to a target with the long billed hat that so many NE striper fishermen used to wear---and then with a baseball-type cap brim. 

    At short distances the long bill didn't make much difference. But with distance casts (more than about 40 feet) they were consistently less accurate wearing the long bill cap.
    My reasoning is that I think we monitor the fly line as it unrolls toward the target. A long bill hat prevent us from seeing the fly line unrolling during a portion of its fight.
    While it has little to do with casting I also think you see more fish when sight fishing wearing a rather short billed cap--and it doesn't blow off your head as quickly when underway in a boat. In short, I see no advantage to wearing a long bill hat--a personal opinion of course.
     
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    Lefty:
     
    I agree.  Back when we used those long billed caps, we had to tie a line from it to our necks since they blew off so often.
     
    I think some of those were "wanna-be" great striper fishermen who needed to look the part.  The surf casters throwing hardware all used them and it carried over to the surf fly fishermen several years ago.
     
    We unconciously do use the timing of the forward unrolling loop, not just for accuracy, but as a basis for the timing for the unseen back cast loop when false casting.        G.
     
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

                                                                       HAUL DIRECTION

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    From Ally Gowans :

    Hi Gordy,

     Your observations re haul direction are exactly the same as mine. Now try to imagine a haul with a two?handed rod and but of course since hauling is impossible imitate the haul by moving the bottom hand, accelerating like a haul to a stop. Move the bottom hand exactly in a ?straight? line directly away from a target and you will be surprised at how accurate you can become.

    This of course is good practice for hauling with a single handed rod, pull exactly opposite the target. In this case the rod hand will be pointing towards the target so an axial haul results anyway for a closed stance. For an open stance caster this may involve some parallax but I don?t think that matters if the haul is opposite the target it seems to work. And it works for all casts.

     Young salmon eat the same diet as young trout, smolts obviously have to adjust to sea feeding and that is one of the reasons that sandeels and other coastal foods are important because a shortage leads to high mortality in the immediate post smolt period.

     Best wishes,

    Ally Gowans

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Ally ....   You have introduced the concept of making the pull of the line hand and/or that of the bottom hand (when two handed casting) in line directly with the target.  Never thought of it that way.      G.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    From Troy Miller :

     There?s a very good reason that you witnessed curved layouts when you made your hauls significantly to the side, Gordy.  If you pay particular attention to the axial orientation of the rod blank when you make the haul (you?ll have to have someone else watch it or video tape it ? you?ll have a hard time seeing it yourself as the caster), you?ll see that your haul is causing torque at the stripper and the blank rotates very much like the rotational wrist break that we intentionally make when making a vertical curve cast.  The rod has initially been loaded in plane with the guides, then the blank is rotated and then rapidly unloaded ? OUT OF PLANE with the intended direction of the loop.  This creates a small amount of horizontal centrifugal momentum in one direction or the other and can only tell the loop to finish unrolling in that direction.  

     

    Have you ever read or heard an accurate explanation of precisely how an overhead curve cast works?  I ask you because I am NOT a reader and I know that you are a great one.  I haven?t ever heard anyone even attempt to explain how it works, but I have my theory (above).

    Regards,
    Troy Miller

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`

    Troy....   I think your description of what happened is correct.  You have also described one way of making a powered curve cast.

    When I did this by exaggerating the direction of the haul, I also moved the rod a bit to the haul side. This is another way of making a curve cast .... to finish the cast so that the rod tip is traveling to the right or left as the rod reaches RSP.  I see that as the way of making all powered ("positive") curve casts.  This happens when we either twist or move the rid tip in a lateral direction as the cast is completed.

    Even as the "Corkscrew" curve cast is made, the rod tip reaches RSP traveling in the direction one wants the fly to go.  I use that one for curves placed way out there .... and loooooong curves.  I'm reasonably sure this one uses both rod torque and lateral thrust combined.

    The underpowered curve cast is very different.  Here, the caster makes an incomplete loop to the side by starting the cast and then moving the rod with negative acceleration.  Of course, this one won't travel around a tree, rock or any other obstruction and is much more difficult to control when its windy.

    An easy to understand description of the curve cast in plain words is to be found starting on p 109 of Lefty Kreh's CASTING WITH LEFTY KREH.

    Another basic description is found on p. 171 of Mac Brown's CASTING ANGLES.

    Gordy

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    From Don Pendleton :

    Gordy,    
    After practicing the hauling direction this afternoon.  The more totally open stance you have it becomes much smoother to keep the haul moment "closer" to rod plane.  A longer smoothly accelerated haul at the proper time seems to keep the rod tip tracking better and the line leg straighter when your body is in an open stance.
     
    Don Pendlton
     
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Don...    Yes.  It is much easier to achieve a haul length matched to the amount of line carried when the movement of the line hand is close to the casting plane (rod plane). This is particularly true when making long casts. As I stated, yesterday, I also found that when I hauled way out to the side, away from this plane, I had trouble maintaining control of acceleration.   G.
     
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    From Gary Davison:
     
    Gordy,
     
    Wanted to run this by you.
     
    I was thinking about the haul and the possible angles when implemented.
     
    I was trying to relate the haul action to a similar analogy in fly fishing that everyone can relate to, and I came up with the following.  
     
    When fighting a fish on a fly rod we tell our students to maintain the 90 degree rule.  The butt of the rod at a 90 degree angle to the fish.  The optimum position for applying pressure when fighting a fish so not to loose the fish or break the rod.
     
    We teach that as you lower the rod tip and point it at the fish , you are applying more pressure on the fish and line.  If you point your rod tip directly at the fish you will most likely break off, because in most cases you have applied so much pressure that you have exceeded the tippet strength.  That straight line path with out any interference caused this excessive force resulting in failure of the line.
     
    This holds true with the Haul as well.  Our goal is to administer as much force to the line as possible.  If you can administer a straight line pull on the line which is parallel with the rod on your haul. Then you are applying the most direct force to the line,  This will result in optimum line speed.
     
    I know major physics comes into play as your angle changes away from straight line pull on the line.  But to keep it simple, this analogy seems to make sense to me. 
     
    All the best
     
        
    Gary Davison
    Gulf Coast Spey
     
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Gary...   I hadn't thought of that analogy.  May help some folks.  A bit of a stretch for others.
     
    I do prefer to think of administering efficiently delivered smoothly applied force to the line sufficient to complete the cast rather than "as much force to the line as possible" for most casts.
     
    While I do agree that the term "force" has well understood meaning as an engineering and physics term  I think you'll agree that it sometimes leads to inappropriate application of power when used in teaching some fly casting students.
     
    For max distance casting, I can't disagree that the application of as much force to the line as one can achieve while maintaining smooth, constant acceleration is a laudable goal.
     
    Gordy
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~